Balchem’s Bourbon & Brainiacs event took place at the Frazier History Museum during the 2025 ADSA annual meetings in Louisville, Kentucky. Dr. Ryan Ordway, Balchem; Dr. Matt Lucy, University of Missouri; Dr. Normand St-Pierre, Ohio State University; Dr. Paul Kononoff, University of Nebraska; Dr. Manda Williamson, University of Nebraska
Balchem’s Bourbon & Brainiacs event took place at the Frazier History Museum during the 2025 ADSA annual meetings in Louisville, Kentucky.
After introductions, Dr. Lucy shares about the ADSA monthly podcast, Dairy Digressions, which he hosts. He discusses listener demographics, the diverse paths to becoming a dairy scientist and inspiring young people to pursue a career in dairy science. The panel goes on to discuss the camaraderie and friendships developed and nurtured at ADSA meetings. (2:44)
Dr. Kononoff asks the panel their thoughts on how to protect students, given the current and potential future funding concerns for science. Dr. Lucy notes he believes science will prevail. Dr. St-Pierre comments we have portrayed science as infallible, when it’s really self-correcting, and the machine of a university is faculty and students. Dr. Kononoff, originally from Canada, discusses the uniqueness of the land-grant system in the US. (8:31)
Dr. Lucy shares some of his favorite parts of being an ADSA member. (17:44)
Dr. Williamson, a neuroscientist, suggests the dairy industry could learn from human behaviorists regarding marketing their products. Dr. Ordway agrees, as someone who did not grow up in the agriculture industry. (20:42)
Dr. St-Pierre talks about presenting at his very first ADSA meeting when he was still learning to speak English. He goes on to discuss how meetings and students have evolved over the years. (23:03)
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Scott Sorrell (00:08):
Uh, so we're here at the Bourbon and Brainiacs, uh, with, with four new panelists. Uh, we got down here, Dr. Ryan Lord. We from Balchem. Got, uh, Dr. Matt Lucy here from University of Missouri. Uh, Dr. Norman St-Pierre from, I guess, are you logging time with Ohio State and Purdue?
Dr. Matt Lucy (00:26):
It's just the Ohio State University.
Scott Sorrell (00:26):
Just the Ohio State University we like. Or just the right. Er, us I've got the, I've got the shirt that says the
Dr. Matt Lucy (00:33):
Yep. National Champions.
Scott Sorrell (00:34):
Exactly. There you go. Dr. Paul Con. There you go. From Nebraska, you're, you're the little engine engine
Dr. Matt Lucy (00:40):
That national sports.
Scott Sorrell (00:42):
Yeah. A few years ago. Yeah. You've got a good quarterback now. I think you guys are gonna make it back. Yeah. So, uh, what we're doing today, we're just celebrating the American Dairy Science Association, uh, the association, all that it does for us and the scientists that make it great. And, uh, so we've invited these panelists here, uh, today with us just to kinda talk about, uh, you know, some of the things that, that, that they enjoy about the American Dairy Science Association. This meeting particular, what's your favorite one? But before we get started, I, I wanted to get Dr. Uh, Matt Luc on specifically today because, um, he does a podcast called Dairy Discretions, which is, uh, digressions Dig Digressions Dairy.
Dr. Matt Lucy (01:24):
There's no discretion. We're not using that name for that.
Scott Sorrell (01:35):
Uh, I, I can't say it, but I am a fan. Yeah. Uh, but, and I, I wanted to get you on just to, to talk a little bit about that. Uh, so go ahead. Just tell us about, uh, the, the podcast when it comes out, and what are you trying to accomplish with it?
Scott Sorrell (01:56):
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Dr. Matt Lucy (02:44):
Yeah. So, um, it came out of a strategic planning initiative with the American Dairy Science Association, and, and they felt like they, um, wanted to start a podcast that sort of featured some of their scientists or their, their scientists and some of that topics. And so, um, and we eventually launched that a couple, couple of years ago. Um, it's, it's supported by the American Dairy Science Association. It's not my podcast. I'm the, I'm the podcast host. And, um, and we have people behind the scenes, Jess and, and, uh, a lot of the heavy lifting is done by Jess. Uh, the podcast is recorded, it's edited, it's professionally edited, and then we put out about one podcast a month. And really the objective is just to talk to scientists and sort of demystify the world of the, of the scientists and also make it a little bit fun and, and, and interesting for our, for our, uh, listeners.
Dr. Matt Lucy (03:39):
And so we are, we're really proud. We have a very young demographic, um, not, not super young, but 30 5-year-old them is the, is the peak in terms of demographic, equally balanced between, uh, men and women. And I love to have fun and I love to ask just crazy questions. And so it gets, it gets a little wild. And the digression is the word. Digression is all part of it. Okay. it is all part of it. Okay. We do get a little off topic at time, but it's been a, it's been a really fun for me, you know, to highlight, um, all the friends that I have. I mean, people go, how do I get on your podcast? Well, you gotta be my friend first, you know, , so write me a send me a Christmas card at least. No, just kidding. The, uh, there we go. We're digressing already. But yeah. You know, but it's, um, it's really fun. It's really a fun podcast.
Scott Sorrell (04:25):
Yeah. No, well, you make it fun, right? I mean, I think that's part of the, what I like about it is you just kind of have some fun with it, get some of these scientific podcasts and it's, it can be kind of boring, but you, you do a nice job just keeping it flowing and, and, and entertaining. So I,
Dr. Matt Lucy (04:39):
I think it's important that particularly young people understand that the path to becoming a dairy scientist, it's not always super linear. And, and that's what always strikes me is you start asking questions and you're, and we, uh, last, uh, last month we had Adam Locke on there, and, and he just explained, you know, I was, I was from a dairy in the UK and I was gonna go back and farm with my dad, you know, and, and then he, uh, met Field Gardens worthy, and, well, actually, he was never gonna go to college, but his dad made him go to college. And this sounds like Adam, you know, you know Adam, you know. Yeah, yeah. And, uh, and, um, you know, so that's interesting. It's interesting that kids hear that, you know, because we need, as you guys can appreciate, um, we need good scientists in dairy, okay.
Dr. Matt Lucy (05:25):
Dairy is, uh, is is a, there's, we have nothing to apologize for dairy industry, nor the nor Milk is a dairy product. And we need good scientists to continue that, that, that, that, that, that heritage. Yep. You know, and if we don't train them, and if they don't go into it, then we don't have the good scientists. And so, um, I'll let, I'll let others talk about that. But I, I, I don't think I could go to work every day if I didn't work for an industry that I felt was doing all, trying to do all the right things, make all the right decisions, feed the world, you know, I don't think I could do it, you know? I mean, I don't think I could make cell phones. I'm sorry. You know, like, uh, I don't think I could do it. It's kinda like, not my gig, you know? But, uh, so it's a, it's an honor to be part of this. Yeah. You
Scott Sorrell (06:15):
Know, might be able to do it, but wouldn't enjoy it. Right. I mean, I Yeah, it's true. Right? I, I love it. I love this job. I love, I love the people. Yeah. It's just a great industry to be around. Yeah.
Dr. Matt Lucy (06:25):
You look at this meeting, um, that we're recording at with Beam, and I look around this room, I must, I, I probably don't have the people here, right. And what other, uh, what other, you know, organization, can I walk into a place like this and feel totally welcome? Right. A bunch of nutritionists too, which is hard for us to read from. Okay. You know, they're like, they're like, I mean, come on. You know, and then, uh, who was a, you know, and, uh, yeah, Mike Van DeHart giving a big tip of the hat to the geneticist, look at all this genetic improvement we've had. And then he throws a little fit to the nutritionist. Well, I guess we had to feed the cows. They
Scott Sorrell (07:02):
Gotta keep up with them.
Dr. Matt Lucy (07:02):
Yeah. And let me, uh, Mike, uh, cows gotta get pregnant before they get milk, so let's, at least I don't think he learned that. Okay. You know, like I teach, I teach freshmen, you know, and, and the, and, and the University of Missouri, and, you know, they're eight, you know, they're 18 year olds. And first lesson is, okay, cow's gotta get pregnant to make milk. And they're like, really? Write that down. Right. You know, , you know, you and there's Paul's wife. Oh my gosh. What are you doing? Come on, sit down with us. .
Scott Sorrell (07:36):
Mandy, welcome to the Real Science Exchange.
Dr. Normand St-Pierre (07:39):
Haven't thought before, have
Scott Sorrell (07:40):
You, Scott? No, I don't believe so. I don't think so.
Dr. Normand St-Pierre (07:42):
It's a ball cabinet. Of course. You know, Ryan.
Dr. Matt Lucy (07:44):
Hi Mandy. Hello.
Scott Sorrell (07:47):
This is not going quite the way you thought it
Dr. Matt Lucy (07:49):
Was gonna, it's digressing. It's already digressed.
Scott Sorrell (07:53):
Matt. Invite Matt to one podcast.
Dr. Matt Lucy (07:56):
I know. And it gets even better.
Dr. Manda Williamson (07:58):
I didn't know that Matt was gonna be on this. I just thought it was Paul by himself. And then I see Lucy over here running his mouth and knew it was gonna be a long night.
Dr. Matt Lucy (08:07):
It's already digressed. Just wait till Jess house hears this when she's like, she's like, we're gonna bring you Oh a, she's normally my caretaker. And she says, you know, stop digressing.
Scott Sorrell (08:21):
So we're just sitting around talking about what we love about the ADSA and this is one of 'em, right? Yeah. Meet with friends. A question. Yeah.
Dr. Normand St-Pierre (08:31):
I actually like to hear Mandy's opinion, everybody's opinion, but Matt Ryan and I actually thought it was quite concerning. One of the questions today at the opening meeting of ADSA is, you know, with some of the funding challenges, how do we protect students? Students are concerned. I think they maybe see a future in dairy science, but I'm kind of curious, Matt, I mean, how is this gonna affect students and what kind of things can we do to support them to find their career in dairy science? Yeah.
Dr. Matt Lucy (09:06):
Well, um, you have to hope that science will prevail. You know, science has would been with us a long time and, and the current situation is, uh, is something that has not, you know, and, and, um, I think what we're gonna learn at the end of all this is that science is important and we need to support science, you know, and the production of food and human health and all these different aspects, you know, and so it's a, it's a challenge, but I think people are gonna, I think science will carry the day. Yeah. So why I believe science will carry the day.
Scott Sorrell (09:39):
Why wouldn't science prevail? I mean, it's, I mean, it just seems to me like we keep learning so much and, and there's seems like there's so much yet to learn, right, right. That, that, that the, the horizon is almost endless for, for science. Specifically in dairy science.
Dr. Matt Lucy (09:54):
And I think, I think, like I said earlier, we have such a great story to tell with, with dairy science and, and, and I, and I would just like to highlight the fact that how important it is, um, that we are able to produce milk economically Yeah. At a price that consumers can afford. You know, if you look at, I don't wanna talk politics, but if you look at what people vote on their pocketbooks, you know, and, and let's face it, we are able to produce milk, uh, so efficiently and then, and then, and then, and then make that milk into products that people love. I mean, come on. Who doesn't like ice cream? Right? Yeah. I mean, you know, who doesn't like,
Scott Sorrell (10:31):
I'm kind of a cheese guy, but
Dr. Matt Lucy (10:32):
Cheese guy. Okay. You know, but cheese or, or cottage cheese or yogurt and all that stuff. And, and the, and the point of the matter is that, that I, I kind of, I, you know, there's been a lot of drama lately, but I kind of smiled when there was this comment about, well, you need to get all the artificial ingredients out of, out of dairy. And I'm like, uh, uh, dyes and weird stuff in dairy. You look, read the label almond juice, it says like, milk and culture and maybe salt, you know? And it's true. It's, it's, it's as close to a natural food as you can get. And I always, um, I always remind people we've been through 200 million years of mammalian evolution and I don't think 200 million years would, uh, lead to a pro a, a food that would kill you. Right. Yeah. You know, it, it ain't there, you know, and, and I also think it's so important that when you look at all the epidemiological data of all the things we should or should not eat, I can't think of a study where it said, don't eat dairy foods. Yeah. You know, it's safe to consume and it's good for you. So that's me. But, you know, I'm kind of crazy. But the, uh, and I digress. Yeah.
Dr. Ryan Ordway (11:38):
Scott,
Scott Sorrell (11:38):
Yet again, your
Dr. Ryan Ordway (11:39):
Question has two sides. The first one is science and the second one was funding.
Dr. Ryan Ordway (11:46):
The science part. We're partly guilty because we have portrayed science as being in favorable Perfect. The truth. And it is not, it converges towards that and it's self-correcting. That's the process. And that's the important part. We have made a lot of mistakes with science, but it does correct itself. Whereas other methods of acquisition of knowledge do not, the funding is a different one. I have seen in my lifetime a greater and greater and greater proportion of funding that goes to indirect cost at universities and foundation, the institutes. And that's where the problem lies. Universities have not, until now, been put under pressure for efficiency. If your budget you had 65% overhead on you will not survive for very long. 'cause your competition wouldn't work with much less than that. When people look, why has tuition increased at five, 6% per year? Has your salary ever gone up by five, 6% per year? No, three, twice percent. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Right. When you got promoted from assistant to associate. Sure. Yeah. And associate to, after that, when you get 2%, you go home and you drink. And that's the issue. You have more and more and more in a growing bureaucracy at universities. And if this forces suddenly the realization of that and the realignment of this, maybe we can live with a few, meet fewer deans. Yeah. And we do fine.
Scott Sorrell (13:17):
Yeah. Interesting. I I just listened to a podcast. I dunno if you ever listened to Andrew Huberman, but he, he was, he had a, a podcast with, uh, the director of the NIH. Yep. It was fascinating. And they talked a lot about this overheads. They talked about research, they talked to, I need to forward that to you. I I need to listen to it again, because it was fascinating. I thought every scientist that I'm involved with needs to hear this thing. 'cause it was just, it was, it was gold. And
Dr. Ryan Ordway (13:43):
And part of that is external forces. When the federal government sends money, then you need to send the reports where the money has gone. And, and, and suddenly you have three people tracking a dollar. And, and so the efficiency of that, they should track the millions, they should track the 10 of thousand. There's a point where when I go and buy glue at, at the grocery store on Sunday to go and patch up the patch on the cow. And I don't have a receipt. I don't think this is, but again, just going back to the, the education. We have a great education system, higher education system. The research we've had in dairy science has today, up till today, have been very good. They also should understand that the machine there is the faculty and the graduate students leave them alone. If you want Matt to be creative, don't ask him to report 50 times a year about what he's doing. Let him do it. And that's, that's the crux of, to me, the problem as I, I look at it from an economic basis.
Scott Sorrell (14:42):
Great point. You wanna answer your own question? You asked us a little while ago.
Dr. Ryan Ordway (14:48):
You know, um,
Dr. Normand St-Pierre (14:51):
I mean, basically my question is, how do we support students to find their career? And, um, I have to say, that's been, I know when I got into my career early, I thought science is what is gonna drive and inspire me. And that is still there. But I think, you know, what I, what I find so cool is, and I find in some ways even more inspiring, is the opportunity to work with students to help them find their career. And, um, really enjoyed as I think, uh, everybody here knows. I'm originally from Canada. I came to the US and it's been fun to move to the US And, uh, obviously, uh, the land grant institution's given me tremendous opportunity. Tremendous opportunity. It's coming from federal funds, uh, state funds, and then just the opportunity to be entrepreneurial with funds to reach out to private companies and, uh, use funds from private companies to push science forward and to also push, uh, students out to help them find their careers.
Dr. Normand St-Pierre (15:58):
And I think, um, I think this happens in, in many countries, but I, I have to say the United States does it in a special way. And it does. So moving the science forward, moving, uh, the field forward, you know, on the farm and then delivering students. And that's by far been my most gratifying way to help these students with concerns. 'cause it's not just all federal funds and when the federal funds aren't there, uh, there is the, the private sector that is, is willing to contribute and needs the students absolutely needs the students. Right. Uh, just in the last month, I've had several, uh, private companies reach out and say, Paul, we know that, uh, your training students with skills that we need. Who are they? How close are they to graduating? And unfortunately right now in our group, we're, uh, couple years away, but, uh, there's a real need for these students as well. So I guess I would just leave it at that. I mean, we've gotta be creative with funds and, and when the federal funds are a little jagged, uh, private sector, I think can help and move in.
Scott Sorrell (17:06):
Excellent. Matt, if you don't mind if I digress. Oh, yes. But, uh, , I was Oh, yes. One of the things we were talking about, uh, earlier was, uh, what, what, what's your favorite part of the A DSA? I mean, how many have you been to over the years?
Speaker 7 (17:22):
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Dr. Matt Lucy (17:44):
Well, uh, I started at Kansas State in graduate school in 83, so I probably went to 84, 85. And then, you know, what happened? I, so I was a member since 83, but then they rejected one of my papers. I canceled my membership. , take that, take that journal of Dairy Science, you know, so I was away in the wilderness for a little while, but then I came back. But then you came back. Okay. And the, um, and I was, uh, lucky because, um, you know what, what happened in my world was, um, it's just a family. It's a family organization, you know, and, and, and in this world, we need family. And what's so interesting about this family is, most of them, you might, you don't see all that often. You see 'em at this meeting, but it's like you just pick up where you left off.
Dr. Matt Lucy (18:38):
And, um, and, and when you get involved with A DSA and get involved in dairy science research, you just meet a lot of great people. I mean, super people, super talented. And so, um, you know, some, I don't know about, I only know one type of science that's dairy science, but you know, oftentimes you hear maybe the, the competitiveness between labs. Yeah. And I'm not gonna share that information with so and so because I don't want that lab to know what we're doing and stuff like that. And you never really get that sense among dairy scientists. I think. 'cause we have a common goal, you know, our common goal is, uh, is sort of the production of milk for, uh, human consumption. And maybe Paul will tell us what, based on she GPT, what our real goal is. But real scope, the real scope of the dairy science. That's another digression, but it's really great. You might have to bleep it out, but I don't know. But the, uh, the, uh, we do edit heavily. So, but we do have heavily, but you know, I come here and I look again, it's the people that really keeps bringing you back. I can't imagine my, um, my life without, uh, this organization and the people that I've met. I've got a question for Mandy. Can I ask a question? Absolutely. Mandy. Mandy's been quite quiet over there.
Dr. Manda Williamson (19:49):
. Nope. I've just taken it all in. Listen to all of you people not talk about how to support students.
Dr. Matt Lucy (19:56):
Mandy's a scientist as well. I think she works with rats or something, you know. And . I dunno. Not, not Paul. I didn't mean Paul . I mean, you know, I mean the, the little ones in the laboratory cages. The little white ones. The little white ones. Tie him up. Do tie em up? I mice, I don't know what you work with amoebas. I don't know. You're like,
Dr. Manda Williamson (20:18):
Do you, would you, do you wanna really actually know? So is
Dr. Matt Lucy (20:21):
It Not really, but I, I enjoy like listing all the different species. I know. Yeah. I see
Dr. Manda Williamson (20:25):
That stream of consciousness is just
Dr. Matt Lucy (20:28):
Stream. So what do you think, you're a scientist. I know you're, I think you're a scientist. You're with UNL. Mm-hmm. What do you think of our meeting?
Dr. Normand St-Pierre (20:35):
Yeah, what do you think of our meeting?
Dr. Matt Lucy (20:38):
? Say something nice that they, alright, well,
Dr. Manda Williamson (20:42):
So my area of training was in neuroscience. And so there's, I have enough just to, to be able to follow along with quite of the, quite a few of the opening conversations and the opening arguments. And, uh, I, I do believe that you need some, uh, human behaviorists when you start thinking about how to get your milk out there.
Dr. Matt Lucy (21:02):
But I,
Dr. Paul Kononoff (21:03):
I will side with you on this, Mandy. Well, thank you, . I mean, I came in my, that match. I did not come from the dairy industry. I mean, my parents worked for the Department of Defense. So I came into the industry and I'm still, after a lot of years am I'll say appalled at how insulated the dairy industry is and doesn't communicate with the consumer. That's all
Dr. Paul Kononoff (21:28):
Agriculture. It's all of
Dr. Manda Williamson (21:30):
Testing. And I think it's probably all of science,
Dr. Paul Kononoff (21:31):
But it's not all of, but it's not all of agriculture. 'cause it's, my, my new role is I cover mono gastrics as well. And you look at swine industry, you look at the poultry industry, that vertical integration has negatives. Right. From an economic perspective to the degree,
Dr. Normand St-Pierre (21:47):
Not economics
Dr. Paul Kononoff (21:49):
From, well, social, right. Um, yeah. Economics, they can control their costs a lot better. But they know the consumer. And Balchem, I mean, we're a human food and company as well as an animal nutrition company. We, our human side of our business knows the consumer. You come to the animal side, we talk to nutritionists, we talk to veterinarians, we talk to even, you know, repro people. Mm-hmm .
Dr. Matt Lucy (22:17):
If we have to. You
Dr. Paul Kononoff (22:18):
Have to talk to have to Yeah.
Dr. Matt Lucy (22:19):
If your cow's not pregnant. Yeah. And
Dr. Paul Kononoff (22:21):
What we don't do is we don't know who is consuming our products. Interesting. And then we interesting. We, I mean it, if you look at the nutrient concentration of dairy products compared to a lot of other food stuffs that are out there, it's amazing. It is. Yeah. Does the average person know that the, the people talking about funding, the people that are coming into the industry, into graduate programs, a lot of them now aren't coming from farmers. And I think that's part of getting the people in is us getting that message out. And I think we're failing at that.
Dr. Matt Lucy (22:58):
Okay. Interesting, interesting, interesting.
Dr. Normand St-Pierre (23:03):
So, Scott, I have a question for the two older gentlemen here. I'm not gonna say who the older gentlemen are, , but I don't even
Dr. Matt Lucy (23:11):
Know, are you talking about North?
Dr. Normand St-Pierre (23:13):
I'm curious. So I agree. Like, the community that comes here is the very similar year out year, year in and year out. And that's one of the things I enjoy the format and the locations have changed drastically since you guys first started coming to the meetings. I'm curious the location of your first couple meetings and what you remember about those meetings. It wasn't at a fancy hotel. Well, uh,
Dr. Ryan Ordway (23:42):
First meeting of ADSA attended was at Virginia Tech in 1980. I could speak about five words of English then . So I had literally,
Dr. Normand St-Pierre (23:52):
You've increased a tech mother,
Dr. Ryan Ordway (23:53):
Mother strawberry, all love you,
Dr. Ryan Ordway (23:56):
And so I had memorized it 12 minutes of my presentation. It's on campus. So you, you were staying in a dorm
Dr. Normand St-Pierre (24:05):
. Yeah.
Dr. Ryan Ordway (24:07):
And, and then you were bringing the, your, your carousel, your Kodak carousel carousel with the slides in. And man, did you hope that nothing he would happen to that because it would've been a disaster
Dr. Normand St-Pierre (24:22):
And you prepared them like three weeks before the meeting that was this last
Dr. Ryan Ordway (24:26):
At at least I literally memorized 12 minutes and half of it. I didn't know what I was saying. . So imagine if you were going to Russia and you memorized the talk in Russia. Yeah. And somebody in there could have put the real nasty sand. You wouldn't know. Yeah.
Dr. Normand St-Pierre (24:44):
Is there a recording of this somewhere? Yeah, yeah,
Dr. Ryan Ordway (24:47):
Yeah. This was,
Dr. Normand St-Pierre (24:48):
It was before recordings existed. Yeah. Yeah.
Dr. Ryan Ordway (24:51):
But so things have changed and probably for the better, uh, the, when you say the constancy, there's a constant evolution also. The, the, the, the younger students, the graduate students today are world apart from where we were and where I'm at today. And it's probably for the better, uh, the, the technology and the access to information of, you know, the, the, we remember a time where the internet did not exist. We didn't have emails. I, when I did my postdoc in New Zealand, I had to use the phone at $3 a minute to call home. And so we had 10 minutes a month. That was it. We put what we were gonna say on the cheat card and that was it. So a lot of things that evolved for the better and, and what was said at one point today, I agree with, we, we hear ai and I see a lot of reluctance to ai.
Dr. Ryan Ordway (25:40):
Well, like any new technology and any new media coming in, there's gonna be some pluses and minuses. So we're gonna have to curb the negative out. But it's gonna do some absolutely wonderful thing. If you think you're gonna lose your job because of ai, think about all the jobs it's gonna create. So it, it's, it's no no different than when the automobile came about and the guy who was taking care of the horses loved their job. Right. But now you have automobile mechanics and so what it means, you're gonna need some retraining. You're gonna need, but it's gonna offer real opportunities. The United States, unless it's, it changes, has allowed the harboring of discovery like nowhere else in the world. Which is why of the 25 largest public corporation in the world, 23 are Americans. Out of the 10, nine of 'em are Americans. They're just the Arab oil, uh, company. The stock market in the US public stock, uh, worldwide is about 125 trillion. The US is approaching 70 trillions of stock being traded. We represent the driving force in innovations.
Dr. Ryan Ordway (26:49):
All we can do is screw it up. And that's what I'm concerned. The downside of this is it does create inequities. That is, when we talk and we talk about food, when I'm always concerned is, let's face it, we're in the top 5%. And so what we hear is what the top 5% think, the bottom 20% of the United States wake up in the morning wondering what they're gonna eat today. That's food insecurity. They do eat, but they, they're not too concerned about the quality about what Let's get, see what we can get. Go and look at the food banks,
Dr. Matt Lucy (27:21):
Banks. She, she agrees with you. Is that, I don't know what that is, like, is not important for everybody. Is that, is is that, uh, Paul, we're supposed to leave now? Or how does that work out?
Dr. Manda Williamson (27:30):
I'm just feeling very validated at the moment. You're
Dr. Matt Lucy (27:32):
Validated Norm. We're gonna invalidate something that Come on
Dr. Manda Williamson (27:36):
Norm. Don't leave me hanging.
Dr. Ryan Ordway (27:38):
The other thing I'm gonna talk about the nutrition. It, it's, when you have a hammer, everything looks like canal. And we have overemphasized absolutely over-emphasized the importance of nutrition in longevity, lifestyle and all of that. There's no question in cows. Bill Weiss and I for five years ran trial. Were really, the treatment was, let's see how we can screw the cow. Let me tell you, they're hard to screw. Yeah. They're really, you need, you need to really hammer 'em down. They're really resilient because the million years of natural selection mm-hmm. And made them that they're not dependent whether you're gonna have the 0.15 grams of, of protein today, as opposed to tomorrow they buffered that way. Now they're not the wild animals anymore, but they're much more resilient than most nutritionists would think. And so are humans. A lot of what we, we hear in humans are based on correlations and there's no cause just association.
Dr. Ryan Ordway (28:32):
And so when they say to people who we this are more, are sicker, well yeah, but guess what? They watch a whole lot more television. They don't move. And so I'm just cautioning with that. That is the progress we've made. The nice thing about dairy science and about researching animals is we can have control research. It's really hard to do research with humans. Every time you go and you ask them, what is it that you eat? They're rung by 50%. They do not, what did you eat on Friday and how much, I don't know, . So you might remember you had mashed potatoes, but how much and what, what is a portion? And then you take the the can, the can of what you mean in this, this little bag. I have three portions. . So Right. You know, it it, so who looks at that? Yeah.
Dr. Ryan Ordway (29:19):
And, and so yeah, very often we, we, we jump, uh, in human nutrition, they will do, um, also research on, on animals where the treatments or 10 x what the humans would be exposed. And so I have said, if you were doing that with water, for somebody to drink 10 times more water than they normally do, you'd kill them. And so water is toxic. And so a lot of that applies nutrition as well. So these, these people start panicking about what's in their food. And, and no, there's, there's some stuff that probably should be withdrawn, but it's not because, it's not because something, it's is natural that it is good. Some of the worst poison ever invented. It's very natural by nature. And it's not because it's synthetic that it's bad. Because in fact you can actually, the engineers can control and have the exact molecule Yeah. Without all the contaminants around. And so we have to move away from this idea that, oh, it's natural and it's good. Um, they're just some good stuff. I don't think it's bad food. There's just some food that if you consume too much, it becomes bad. Yeah, absolutely. So a bag, a whole bag of potato chip is bag. Two chips are not going to kill you. Yeah.
Dr. Matt Lucy (30:28):
I like, I like potato chips. I I eat 'em every day. I mean, I don't really know, but the, uh, Lay's potato chips. It's potato.
Dr. Normand St-Pierre (30:35):
We have two Pennsylvanians.
Scott Sorrell (30:38):
You can't eat just one
Dr. Matt Lucy (30:39):
Go Pennsylvania potato chips. Alls it is potatoes, oil and salt. I mean, there's nothing more natural than oil and salt is there? No. . It's a great preservative. . . I, come on.
Dr. Normand St-Pierre (30:52):
What's your favorite Pennsylvania potato chip?
Scott Sorrell (30:56):
Oh, there's a lot of them. Or that are pretzels?
Dr. Paul Kononoff (30:59):
Well, well I'm, I'm originally from Chambersburg, so I'm a little partial to uh Kay and Rays. It's from, uh, Shippensburg, Pennsylvania.
Dr. Matt Lucy (31:08):
I mean, I did not know it was a thing. Potato chips in Pennsylvania. Oh yeah. And they even do they have potatoes?
Dr. Paul Kononoff (31:15):
One's the number one producer of potato chips in the country. Yeah.
Dr. Matt Lucy (31:19):
Yeah. You know what, what's your favorite
Dr. Paul Kononoff (31:20):
One? That
Dr. Matt Lucy (31:21):
Would be Middlesworth. Yeah. Yeah.
Dr. Paul Kononoff (31:24):
Do love middlesworth.
Dr. Matt Lucy (31:25):
I grew up, I grew up in Syracuse, New York, and Pennsylvania was just an annoying state in drive-thru to get to Florida. I mean, you
Dr. Paul Kononoff (31:33):
Know, and the New Yorkers are the annoying people that drove
Dr. Matt Lucy (31:36):
Through. Gotta, and then forget it, if you're going this way on the East West Pennsylvania,
Scott Sorrell (31:40):
I did that yesterday by the
Dr. Matt Lucy (31:42):
Torture. But that's another, you got
Dr. Paul Kononoff (31:43):
Apples. We had potato chips and pretzels and beer
Dr. Matt Lucy (31:47):
And, and double
Dr. Paul Kononoff (31:48):
Starch everything.
Dr. Matt Lucy (31:50):
Let's just
Dr. Normand St-Pierre (31:51):
Mashed potatoes and corn.
Dr. Paul Kononoff (31:53):
No, you, you forgot the, that's the corn's the vegetable. It's a vegetable and you forgot the bread. It's actually a triple starch. Yeah.
Dr. Matt Lucy (32:03):
I love this.
Scott Sorrell (32:04):
Thank you for joining us today for this episode of Dairy Digressions and the Real, real Science Exchange. We hope you learned something. I know you had some fun, and I hope to see you next time here at Real Science Exchange, where it's always happy and you're always among friends.
Speaker 7 (32:20):
We'd love to hear your comments or ideas for topics and guests. So please reach out via email@anh.marketing at balchem.com with any suggestions, and we'll work hard to add them to the schedule. Don't forget to leave a five star rating on your way out. You can request your Real Science Exchange t-shirt in just a few easy steps, just like or subscribe to the Real Science Exchange. And send us a screenshot along with your address and t-shirt size to anh.marketing@balchem.com. Balchem’s real science lecture series of webinars takes place on the first Tuesday of every month with the top research and nutrition topics that will impact your business. We also include small ruminant, monogastric, and companion animal focused topics throughout the year. Visit bachem.com/realscience to see the upcoming topics and to register for future webinars. You can also access past webinars and search for the topics most important to you.